Biblical Universalist Discussion Forum
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Zach
Aug 23, 07 - 6:20 PM |
What, to you, is the most persuasive argument for universalism?
I'm interested in seeing what everyone says to this. I'm also curious whether anyone will bring up some good ones worth discussing. For me, it's Colossians 1:16-20: "...because in him were the all things created, those in the heavens, and those upon the earth, those visible, and those invisible, whether thrones, whether lordships, whether principalities, whether authorities; all things through him, and for him, have been created, 17and himself is before all, and the all things in him have consisted. 18And himself is the head of the body -- the assembly -- who is a beginning, a first-born out of the dead, that he might become in all [things] -- himself -- first, 19because in him it did please all the fulness to tabernacle, 20and through him to reconcile the all things to himself -- having made peace through the blood of his cross -- through him, whether the things upon the earth, whether the things in the heavens." (Young's Literal Translation) Another argument which I've found pretty convincing is Elhanan Winchester's addition to the argument that God "will not contend forever," which is that God says that He does not want "the souls which I have made" to "fail before me" (Isaiah 57:16); Winchester suggests that those who support the doctrine of endless torment must therefore "prove that he hath not made all souls." (The Universal Restoration, page 120.) |
Pawz
Aug 23rd, 2007 - 7:46 PM |
Re: What, to you, is the most persuasive argument for universalism?
Zach, thank you for the Isaiah scripture, I shall add that to my notes. KJV does not make it as plain as you describe, but Young does. For me the fact that God IS God means that His will SHALL be done - nothing takes Him by suprise, and nothing will happen that He does not allow. If He says He desires that ALL men shall be saved, then that IS what will happen. He has sworn by it, and His word will not return to Him empty. There are other things to be taken into consideration of course - the manifold witness of the scriptures, the character of Our loving heavenly Father, the example of how He treated Israel being how He will treat everyone, His own words which He cannot go against - lots, but for me it is the fact that God is Supreme, no-one and no-thing can get the better of Him, suprise Him, thwart His plans or prevent His will from being accomplished. If God says it, desires it, swears it and proclaims it, whatever 'it' is, it WILL be so. |
Mike Burke
 Aug 24th, 2007 - 6:21 AM |
Re: What, to you, is the most persuasive argument for universalism?
In addition to Col. 1:16-20, and 1 Tim. 4:10, I think a strong argument can be made from Heb. 12:23. Calling those who are saved in this age "first born," seems to imply the growth of God's family beyond this age. Also, as Elhanan wrote on page 98: What consequences must follow from the supposition, that some of God's creatures shall always remain His enemies! Either God created some to be miserable to endless ages, or must be frustrated eternally in His designs... Like Elhanan, I find these consequences unacceptable (and I believe this is a strong argument in favor of universal reconciliation.) G-d Bless |
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pawz
Aug 24th, 2007 - 6:21 AM |
Re: What, to you, is the most persuasive argument for universalism?
I agree Mike 
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Mike Burke
Aug 24th, 2007 - 6:34 AM |
Re: What, to you, is the most persuasive argument for universalism?
Thanks Pat (and thanks for your participation in our discussions here.) G-d Bless. |
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